ManagerKnowledgeOfEmployeePersonalLife

Edgar, a manager, asked me to give him feedback about his peformance. During the meeting, he commented that one of his employees gave him feedback that he didn't know enough about her personal life. He said he didn't think knowing about the personal life of his employees was a part of his job. He wasn't seeking my feedback on that matter so I didn't give him any.

I've been pondering what is appropriate and useful to try to discover about an employee's personal life and what isn't. And I also wonder how the gender of the manager and employee impacts appropriateness. Is appropriateness different if the person is a teammate versus an employee? What are the legal issues?

Would you share any experiences that you have about this topic?

Thank you.

SteveSmith 2004.09.16

Steve - I've struggled with this also. I've been told that 'people' (employees) often consider me cold and unfriendly. I don't have an answer that I'm confortable with. For one thing, I am very aware that there are legal issues around hiring and firing someone, and I don't want to get caught in them.

And on a personal plane, I spoent many years of my youth feeling responsible for EVERYTHING and EVERYBODY around me. It was a frantic failure, and it was really hard to learn that I couldn't do that anymore. Maybe I've gone too far the other way, but...

I try to be friendly with my employees but I don't want to be their friend. I try to remember to ask about their personal lives, but I don't and won't get into conversations about their latest boyfriends and who's sleeping with whom. Most of my office eployees are considerably younger than I am, and I do have some strong opinions about life. <wry g> I bite my tongue a lot, but I won't give advice or express an opinion about something that's not related to work. (I may say something privately to my husband, once I get home, but certainly not at the office.)

Ultimately, my responsibility is, and must be, to the company itself, not to any one employee.

--SuePetersen 2004-09-17

I try to be friendly with my employees but I don't want to be their friend.

Sue, A manager early in career my said the same thing. She later became a peer and then a friend.

A friend became the manager of a team that I was a member of. I must admit it changed the friendship for a little bit. And the problem was mine rather than his.

I suspect many people have similar problems being friends with someone they manage or someone who manages them.

SteveSmith 2004.09.19

And now for something completely different. :-)

I will openly admit that I am a strong E, but I try to know quite a bit about each of the people on the teams I lead. (While the title may fit, I am still struggling against the manager word.) I find that knowing and asking questions about people's personal lives helps me to understand them much better and that taking that into account is appreciated and I think makes our team more effective.

AlanSmith 2004.09.20

I find that knowing and asking questions about people's personal lives helps me to understand them much better and that taking that into account is appreciated and I think makes our team more effective.

I do too.

Alan, would you share some examples of where it's helped you?

SteveSmith 2004.09.20

There's a difference between knowing the details of someone's personal life and knowing what that person wants out of work. I coach my manager clients on how to understand what people want out of work. If the employee chooses to share information about his or her personal life, that's ok, but it's a very slippery slope. If a manager has to fire someone and chooses to fire or lay off based on knowledge of the employee's personal life instead of work performance, and the employee discovers that, the manager and company are open to lawsuits. This is not a case where a black-and-white answer is possible. -- JohannaRothman 2004.09.20

This is not a case where a black-and-white answer is possible.

Sounds like an answer that can be given for many important matters.

Johanna, when you were working for a corporation what, if anything, did you want your manager to know about your personal life? Do you think your manager should know that you are married? What did management know that you didn't want them to know?

For instance, I know a lot of people who have children in daycare. One of the parents must pick up the kid(s) by 6:00 PM. Otherwise they pay a heavy penalty to the daycare center. Is this a constraint that an employee should be afraid to discuss with their manager? That's the kind of information that I suspect Edgar thinks is irrelevant, which scares me. Do you think it's irrelevant?

I would like to know about relevant personal information that is not in the gray area and would be useful for management to seek out and know.

SteveSmith 2004.09.20

All personal information is relevant. The question is what's permissible to use, not what's relevant. This is a question of laws, but not if you have fewer than, I believe, ten employee s (in the United States).

Put another way, like any laws, it's a question of whether you get caught. If you don't get caught, you're not breaking a law. But if you want to make a moral question out of this, then it's a different discussion. - JerryWeinberg 2004.09.20

I have struggled with this discussion. I wanted to jump in early and say that sure, knowing personal information is a good thing for a manager. I held off (good idea) and listened as several people raised important reasons why NOT to know much personal information.

I like to know personal information about the people with whom I work. I "manage" eight or ten people (depending how I count). Personal information can help us all at work.

Examples, one man here spent the weekend in Las Vegas with friends. He grew up in Arizona; he has been to Las Vegas several dozens times; if one of us makes a business trip to Las Vegas he is a great source of information on where to stay and how to get around.

Another man here grew up in the Washington D.C. area. He knows many of the suburban areas and how to navigate the roads. Whenever we have to visit another facility in the area we ask him the best way to drive.

A woman here grew up in Boston. We make business trips to Boston now and then. She is a great source of information about that city.

I could go on with several examples from each person in the office and how their personal information helps the group.

Maybe the word "personal" and how we each interpret it is driving this discussion. I don't ask and don't want to know about the "love-life" of people in the office. I do like to know about where people grew up, where they live, what they like to do in their spare time. The outside interests of people tell me what they really love to do. Sometimes that helps me assign work. If a person loves staring through a telescope to see stars and birds, that person is probably a good choice for a project that involves optics. They love optics, they will probably do a good job on an optical project.

DwaynePhillips 21 September 2004

Alan, would you share some examples of where it's helped you?

Here are a few examples that I can think of:

- Giving additional understanding and "slack" during difficult personal times for people results in tremendous loyalty. (I know that some people say that the only thing that matters is what people can contribute today, but I unashamedly say that I believe they are wrong.)
- Scheduling different people's deadlines (when possible) around personal events so that they aren't put in a bind. (e.g. Make the deadline a day before their anniversary instead of the day of their anniversary.)
- Accomodating personal religious preferences (such as not working on certain days, etc.)
- I had an employee that HATED plane travel. So I worked to try to minimize their travel by changing their assignments.
- Understand days of fasting and try to accomodate by not having a team lunch on one of these planned days.

I am realizing as I put these down, that I am giving examples of where I have used that knowledge, but not in how it has helped me.

I believe that I have lower turnover and higher morale based on these things, but that is almost impossible to tell because it could have to do with the inclination of members on my teams anyway.

I agree with Dwayne that perhaps it is the definition of "personal". For example, I don't want to know about "love-life". However, I like knowing that one of the guys that works for me loves movies. (Tickets to an art film festival would be a good reward for him.) Another loves the batting cages (GC there would be a good reward for him.) I could go on and on with this, and while I believe it helps me motivate better I can't prove it.

Well, enough rambling for today.

--AlanSmith 2004.09.21

Alan & Dwayne - yes, I think we are stumbling over the different definitions of 'personal'. And probably also the different worlds we work in. For instance, I work in a blue-collar construction environment and I suspect it's a bit rougher than the world you inhabit daily. In the past several years, I've had several young office employees who's standard conversation involved who was sleeping with whom, and who was trying/not trying to get pregnant. I've got a bit sensitized to it, and I just don't want to deal with it any more.

I don't have a problem at all with the types of examples you two give above. I assume that kind of info comes out in the general course of working together. I would certainly try to take it into account when assigning work hours and jobs. For instance, a standing joke around our office is the guy whose radio "stops working" when he gets around the river during fishing season. He takes one day a week off during fishing season, and may take an occasional day during the week. Every once in a while I start making pointed comments about "the lack of fish in my diet" and he shows up with salmon steaks for everybody. <g> It's been a standing joke for years. Another guy takes off during hunting season.

I do, of course, understand day care schedules and sick kids, and I will bend over backwards to make allowances for them. At some point, the company's needs have to take priority, but I don't remember ever reaching that point over day care or kids. The people I've had to let go over the years have been because of personality conflicts, or issues with their work and/or honesty.

--SuePetersen 2004.09.21

I think the title of this page set up some assumptions. If we had called it "manager knowledge of employees as persons," we might have taken some different turns. I believe it helps (can) to know your employees (or managers) as persons, but you have to use what you know sensibly. There's no getting around that. And, there's no getting around that you might learn some things about a person's "personal life" when you get to know them as persons (like who's sleeping with whom). You have to learn what information is appropriate to act on, to comment on, or just to keep to yourself. (None if it is okay to gossip about, BTW.) - JerryWeinberg 2004.09.21

Sue,

You are right that your work environment is probably a little "rougher" than mine. ;-) (For those that don't know, I work in a LARGE high tech company surrounded by engineers.) Also, those in my group are cognizant of my beliefs and so generally try not to tell me things they believe would make me uncomfortable. (For example: where they spent last night. ;-) ) I don't want to know these things either.
I did have an interesting scenario (in the past) where someone told me that they might be moving in a year or so. I counseled that person to keep that information to themselves so that it wouldn't affect their career at the company. I told them that as long as it was merely a possibility I saw no reason for that to be a basis for my decisions. I tried to not let it interfere and I think I was successful. (Although I have to be honest and say that I didn't forget.) (It turned out that they didn't move.)

--AlanSmith 2004.09.22

I think the title of this page set up some assumptions. If we had called it "manager knowledge of employees as persons," we might have taken some different turns.

Right you are.

The group did hit my target though. I appreciate Sue, Dwayne and Alan for sharing their stories. They helped me.

I think Edgar, the manager who said knowing about someone's personal life wasn't his job, also meant that he didn't need to have any knowledge of his employees as people. Why do I say that? Because his employees tell me, without me even asking, that he doesn't know anything about them. Sad.

SteveSmith 2004.09.20

Updated: Wednesday, September 22, 2004